Talk:Ragna Blade

I couldn't find an exact incantation for the spell yet in the web sources, as I am 99% certain that the text at Slayers Universe is wrong. For instance, the english translation always mentions something like "power that can smash even the souls of gods", and I am also able to make out the word "kami" in the japanese incantation, but there's no sign of it there.

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Reverted the previous edits, because they seem to be taken from Slayers Universe. (See above) --Pip25 09:00, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

The incantation in Slayers Universe is incomplete, and it adds the Boost incantation. The Ragna Blade's is this:

Akumu no ou no hitokake yo Sora no imashime tokihanatareshi kooreru kuroki utsuro no yaiba yo Waga chikara waga mi to narite tomo ni horobi no michi o ayuman Kamigami no tamashii sura mo uchikudaki

spell versions
This isn't mentioned, but in the novels there are two versions of the Ragna blade; an incomplete and a completed form.

The incompleted form

"Lord of the dreams that terrify Sword of cold and darkness Free yourself from the bonds of heaven Become one with my power, one with my body And let us walk the path of destruction together Power that can smash even the souls of the gods Ragna Blade"

was derived from the incorrect knowledge that the Lord of Nightmares was the demon lord of demon lords that fell from the heavens and shook the sea of chaos.

The completed form (english version is all I know)

"Fragment of the Lord of Nightmares Release thy heavenly retribution Sword of cold black nothingness become one with my power, one with my body Together, let us walk the path of destruction and smash even the souls of the gods Ragna Blade"

was created by Lina after she learned the Lord of Nightmares was the sea of chaos itself, and therefore the foundation for all exsistance and power.

Lina was shown able to use the incompleted version for a minute or so in book six. She is only able to use the completed sword against Gaav for about 5 seconds.

Origins
I think we can change this line: It isn't known when and where did Lina Inverse, the only known caster of this spell, gain knowledge of the Ragna Blade, but it can be assumed that it isn't her original creation, as she mentions it as "the spell I read about", since the Ragna Blade seems to be Lina's original spell. It was one of those spells she calls "Spells that Should Work but Don't" (the silver beast, p.161). The knowledge for the spell, since it cast upon the power of L-sama, came from the time she read a book while she was a little girl, and where she learned about the "Golden King of the Dark Lords", that turned to be L-sama. Besides, I don't remember her saying "the spell I read about", talking about the Ragna Blade. If it's in the novels, where is it? And if it's from the anime... you know what's going to be, translation error. --shansito 18:49, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't recall ever hearing "the spell I read about" either. I do know that the "book she read while she was a little girl" you mentioned was an incomplete transcription of the Claire Bible manuscipt from Dils, the one Xelloss burned. She says in The Silver Beast that most of it was corrupted over the years, but that she knows some of it was real because she derived the Giga Slave from it (don't have the exact pg number on hand, but it's when Xelloss first tells Lina he's looking for "a manuscript"). --130.253.154.67 19:08, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I disagree. The quote is from the anime, where it is explicitly mentioned that she read about the spell earlier, but the Claire Bible manuscript was the first occasion she found an (although incomplete) description of it. I'll re-check the exact scene tomorrow; but if you claim it to be a translation error, then perhaps you should prove it... The English dub isn't perfect, but openly disregarding it is kind of silly in my opinion.
 * About the novels; as Oyashiro mentioned, Lina created the Giga Slave using the manuscript from Dills, there is no mention of the Ragna Blade being of the same origin. In fact, Lina mentions that the Ragna Blade belongs to the area of "forbidden magic", which most sorcerers would advise against using, as it draws power from LoN. Now since we have no knowledge of any other spell aside of the two that has this power source, if the Ragna Blade would be Lina's original too, then the category she mentions would seem pointless ans somewhat contradictory. --Pip25 23:32, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * My understanding was that the Ragna Blade was forbidden magic because it called on the power of the Lord of Nightmares, something which sorcerers are never supposed to do. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Lina also refers to immortality research as "forbidden magic", in both the novels and anime (the anime has the "bamboo branch of immortality" gag). Thus, "forbidden magic" would refer to any spells that are considered too dangerous to cast, not merely the two invented by Lina. --Oyashiro08 00:46, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * You are right, that wasn't a very convincing argument. I would just like to re-iterate that the novels also say nothing that would suggest that the Ragna Blade was made by Lina Inverse.
 * Now for the anime scene, it goes like this (Episode 11, Slayers Next):
 * Lina: Hmm, it's written in runes.
 * Just what I'd expect from the legendary Claire Bible.
 * Anyway, what does it say...?
 * This... It can't be! It is! It definitely is!
 * It's a technique described that would be as powerful...
 * ..an attack spell as the Giga Slave!
 * ...after a few rumblings from a jealous Martina...
 * With this I'll be able to complete and try that spell I just read about...
 * Now even if the bolded line would be some kind of a translation mistake, the whole scene surely isn't, and from it it's clearly obvious that Lina learned of the specifics of the Ragna Blade from that book. As for the question of where did she read about it first, that does depend on the correctness of this line, but unless a translation mistake is pointed out, there is no reason to believe that what the line says isn't correct. --Pip25 08:44, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Now even if the bolded line would be some kind of a translation mistake, the whole scene surely isn't, and from it it's clearly obvious that Lina learned of the specifics of the Ragna Blade from that book. As for the question of where did she read about it first, that does depend on the correctness of this line, but unless a translation mistake is pointed out, there is no reason to believe that what the line says isn't correct. --Pip25 08:44, 16 January 2009 (UTC)


 * But Lina didn't mention the Ragna Blade as being forbidden :/ she just said that it was an spell that had "special needs", since it needs an incredible amount of magic to be casted. In fact, she doesn't even mention LON in that novel as the source for it. She probably knew that the source of magic for the spell could be the same she used for the Giga Slave, but until she meets the Claire Bible, she doesn't seem to know it's L-sama.
 * As for what she says in the anime, I'll try asking Patas about that line. In the spanish version she only says "This book is about a Giga Slave level spell... reading this, I'll be able to control it", it doesn't mention that she knew anything about it before. --shansito 14:37, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * In the novel version, at least, Lina definitely mentions that the Ragna Blade is forbidden magic. In her narration, she says that she has an idea for gathering darkness into the form of a sword, which she is pretty sure will breach Zanaffar's hide, then says as a quick aside that what she's about to do falls into the area of forbidden magic, because it draws power from the same source as her most secret of secret spells, the Giga Slave: the Lord of Nightmares. I'm not sure if she explicitly calls it forbidden in the anime, though.
 * It wasn't mentioned as forbidden in the anime, just in novel 5. I am very interested what Patas has to say about this though. :) --Pip25 16:05, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

All that mess about Ragna Blade (and maybe some other parts of Slayers) is caused by Slayers being incomplete, I mean itś not reality. If it was real, we would have known the truth competely clearly. Anyway, we must take it as only story created by humans. --78.141.89.16 18:17, 8 February 2009 (UTC)Xellos